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In this episode, Messellech “Selley” Abebe chats with Tracy Kaplan about why kids deserve honest, age-appropriate news, and the importance of slowing down in a world full of misinformation. Kaplan is the creator of The Ten News, a podcast that makes current events accessible for curious kids and their families. Together, Abebe and Kaplan discuss how to navigate misinformation, why fairness is at the heart of what kids care about, and the ways parents and educators can guide tough conversations. This conversation highlights the power of listening to kids—and trusting them to ask the questions that matter most.

To learn more about Tracy Kaplan and her work, you can check out her podcast The Ten News, and follow her on Instagram, and Twitter.

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Transcript

Tracy Kaplan  0:01  

From the kids that, that we engage with, they want the world to be fair for themselves and for their friends, and for kids that you know live in other parts of the world that they don’t even know.

Selley Abebe  0:15  

On today’s Speaking of Kids. What if our kids are already the kind of humans we’re trying to raise? Hey, there ambassadors. Selley here. Okay, so how many of you have tried to listen to the news recently with your kids and thought this is not gonna work? It’s too much. Either you feel like the content is way over their heads or too dark, or, you know, suddenly there’s a strange pharmaceutical ad, and you don’t really want to explain. Our guest today really gets that, and in fact, that’s why she created something better. Tracy Kaplan is the creator of The Ten News, a podcast that makes the news work for kids. And not just any kids. But curious question-asking nonsense-detecting kind of kids. Does that sound familiar? I know it does for me. My oldest, who is going to be nine soon, asks all of the questions. And I know sometimes, as a parent, it has been really hard to answer her questions in a way that fully answers them, but doesn’t give her too much. And so, for example, she asked a lot of questions around the Ukraine, Russia war. And more recently, she’s been asking about Israel and Iran. And sometimes it is very hard to give kids that are curious, that want to know the right information, that may hear misinformation at school from other people. You want as a parent to set the record straight and keep your kids informed, but sometimes you just don’t have the words. So in this episode, we’re talking to Tracy Kaplan about why she built the show, how she tackles big topics like misinformation and gun violence without sugar coating it, and what she has learned from the kids who do listen. 

Selley Abebe  2:17

Tracy, I am so excited to talk to you today.

Tracy Kaplan 2:19  

I’m really, really happy to be here.

Selley Abebe  2:23  

So I have a eight year old, six year old and two year old. As you know, I was recently made aware of this podcast, and so I said, I have to listen to it with my kids. And so when I tell you, I crave the time when I’m alone with just my eight year old, because the two year old never, he’s just like, I need something different. But The Ten News is amazing, and so for all of our listeners and their kids, The Ten News is a weekly news podcast for kids that’s centered on 10 things that curious kids want to hear all about. And right now, it is in its fifth season and has produced over 500 episodes.

Tracy Kaplan  3:03

Yes.

Selley Abebe  3:03

Which is wild.

Tracy Kaplan  3:04  

And we do a monthly deep dive on a topic. So knowing that, you know, during the week, when we’re doing our 10 things, there are so many topics that really can’t be covered in that short of a time span, so once a month, we’ll do a deeper dive on a particular topic.

Selley Abebe  3:21  

And so can you tell our audience, where did this idea come from?

Tracy Kaplan  3:25  

YouTube, actually. But not, not in the way that you would think. So, it was right before COVID. I was talking to my kids about, they were 8 and 10 at the time, and I was talking to them about who was running in the Democratic primaries at the time. And without missing a beat, they went, Mike will get it done. And I realized that they knew Mike Bloomberg’s campaign slogan because of YouTube ads. And I have a parent who I used to manage a partnership with YouTube. I’ve paid attention to the content that my kids were watching. It never occurred to me to be thinking about what ads they were seeing. So that’s where, kind of the kernel of this idea first started. And then fast forward a month or two, and the pandemic hit, and I realized that now my kids, and many kids around the country, around the world, were disconnected from their schools, from their friends, you know, kind of all the places where you go and you talk through questions that you have, or, you know, concerns or things that are going on in the world that you want to talk through with your friends or with trusted adults. They were cut off from all of that. So that’s where this idea first really came together, of, I want my kids to have something that they can feel like is theirs. That’s not just me saying, hey, let’s sit down and listen to the news together, and now I have to be worried about what’s coming on, because it’s probably not going to be a kid appropriate. Thinking about, you know, eight to 12 year olds listening so really wanting them to have a show that was for them.

Selley Abebe 5:06  

I love when moms create stuff, and we could have a whole nother podcast episode on your background, which is so fascinating, but it’s so accurate, you know. And I love this for my kids and, you know, future conversations. But you really, you know you don’t shy away from big topics. You know, headlines include Republicans for Harris and age limits for Congress. You know, you get into heavy stuff. What does that look like on a weekly basis, and how, where do those topics come from?

Tracy Kaplan  5:42  

It’s really challenging because we don’t know where any of our listeners are in terms of their overall knowledge base of what’s going on in the world. So I am very, very mindful that if we are doing something heavy, that we’re following it up with, then something lighter. I never want it to be, you know, an entire episode where it’s just, you know, beat after beat of tough headlines. Because even as adults, right? We need, we need some balance. We need a break. So I’m very mindful of that. And then, really, when I’m stuck, I go to kids. That’s, really has been kind of the privilege of doing the show. And the magic of doing the show is I never pretend that I know exactly what a child’s thinking. So I will go directly to, I have, you know, a trusted group of kids that I’m constantly being like, Hey, can you tell me what you think about this? Or, you know, have you heard about this? That’s, that’s usually how I start, is like, have you heard to see what they’re what they’re hearing in the ether. And then I’ll always try to find kids who can come on the show and, and help give some first person perspectives of topics. A great example of this is when we did an episode on gun violence. We couldn’t not do an episode on gun violence. It was, you know, a period of time where it was really taking over all of, all of the news coverage. Parents were looking for ways to talk to their kids about it. So for the first time ever, we did a two parter, which the first part was geared towards parents, to kind of help them in terms of how to broker these conversations, how to think about what is age appropriate, to share or not. And then the second part was kind of our usual approach, where we’re talking to, you know, our kid listeners and their families. And we invited a teen activist to come on so that she could talk from her perspective of why she got involved as a student leader, how gun violence had affected her life. And that way, I knew that she was going to relate to the audience and develop a connection that wouldn’t necessarily be there for, you know, a tough topic like this, If it was just an adult speaking.

Selley Abebe  8:02 
I love that there’s so much intention put behind the show. Because I can imagine, you know, for someone 7, 8 listening, for someone even 11, 12, 13, listening, that’s a big gap developmentally. 

Tracy Kaplan  8:16  

Yeah, absolutely. And it keeps me up at night. I will say there are times where I will be hesitant to do a topic because I haven’t figured out with the team the right approach, and then all of a sudden, one day, it’ll just click. Like, I’ll be reading something, or I’ll be at my son’s school and I’ll be talking to a teacher about how they’re addressing it, and then that’ll just kind of open it up like, well, we’ll figure out the way in, that’s right for The Ten News.

Selley Abebe  8:45  

I love talking to educators period, because they’re just the smartest people at understanding the world. But then also, you know, young people. And so because you connect with, with kids in such a meaningful way, have you found that kids tend to come up with common sense solutions that just make sense?

Tracy Kaplan  9:05  

Absolutely, I feel like we don’t give them as much credit as we should, for what thoughtful approaches they come up with and how much they care. I think that’s, that’s another piece too. You know, I read all of our podcast reviews that we get on Apple and Spotify. And the thing that always strikes me is when kids ask us to come back to a topic that we haven’t talked about in a while. I think as adults, we’re kind of used to the news cycle just moving through and it always strikes me when a great example is the Ukraine war. I mean, it was really out of, kind of mainstream media as a topic, and my listeners were saying, Hey, could you give us an update, like, what’s going on? And so that, that’s really become a tenant for me and the team of always making sure that big events that are happening around the world that we’re regularly coming back to them, and not just kind of putting them aside because that’s what we’re seeing other media do.

Selley Abebe 10:04  

And I think that’s so important, because it helps kids and adults too, right? Like, stay with something and see what’s moving or what’s not moving. And I think for kids, as you get older, you could think back and say, hey, when I was 8, I started listening to this podcast when I was 8, and they’re still talking about this same topic, and they have, you know, like we haven’t made progress, and that’s the age when they can start to vocalize some of this, right?

Tracy Kaplan  10:32  

Well, you just reminded me that we did a thing about age limits in Congress. I think that was two years ago. I, I’d have to look back, but it was not this year when, when it’s been, you know, maybe last year. But, you know, now I’m gonna, I’m gonna go back and republish that.

Selley Abebe  10:49  

Yeah, I’m sure that that that would be, that would be interesting right now. You know, but we talked about this a little bit, and I think you’re gonna have really good insight here because of your background, is this topic of misinformation. I know I’m very concerned with, you know, just limiting access to social media to just YouTube. I mean, YouTube is, that’s where my kids gravitate right now, and it does terrify me, like the ads sometimes. They, I don’t know where they come, they like you think a program is fine, and then I’ll tune in and it’s like, what is this? But just even when things are produced intentional miscommunication and misinformation, how have you really navigated that space as it relates to kids? And do they even realize there, there is misinformation targeted towards them, or, you know, just to be weary of all the things.

Tracy Kaplan  11:46  

Yeah, you know, again, they’re super smart and probably more savvy about video than we are, that they know that it’s there, but they still fall for it. So that that’s really what I’ve seen, is that they’re they’re very savvy and knowing that it exists and knowing it’s out there, but we’re all human. I mean, there was something the other day, a photo of bears sitting outside, you know, basically sitting on the ground, all in front of Yosemite that someone had put on social and I fell for it. I was like, oh, what’s going on? There’s like, a bear blockade. And then I looked at the comments, and someone was like, this is actually fake. And then I, you know, because I’m who I am, I went that extra mile. Don’t ask me the other work I was supposed to be doing at that time. But I went down the rabbit hole of proving that it wasn’t real. And it is a topic of conversation that we regularly come back to so, as you’re saying about topics, this is the biggest. And we’ve we’ve come at it from all sides. We actually did a segment on, there is a group called Birds aren’t Real, which is a whole group that has basically come at it from a satirical like, what if you told someone that birds actually weren’t real, and they’ve created a whole movement around this. And the point is to call out kind of the absurdity of some of the conspiracy theories and things that are out there. So we covered that in the show to show kids about that. Bridget Todd, who is an amazing expert in this, in the space she hosts the podcast, there are no girls on the internet. Her and I did a panel together at the last podcast movement where we went really deep talking about the misinformation that’s out there. And I think the biggest thing that we try to do is highlight examples so that kids and their families can just be better consumers and really questioning, you know, what’s the source on this, but also pausing like we are in such an environment of rapid fire news, and wanting to know the facts and the story so quickly, and I’m even slowing down as I’m saying this, because it’s something we talk a lot about on the show. We’ll say we’re reporting on this, but we don’t have all of the information. Or we’ll say this changed because it new information was learned. And so really making the point that you’re just not going to know everything in the first five minutes, and if someone says that they do, they’re probably reporting false information. Because it takes a while in chaotic situations, in unfortunately, tragic situations like it takes a while for the dust to settle and for the facts of something to truly come out. But we live in this environment where we’re like, we have to know right now, right now. And so, you know, we’re not afraid of saying, you know, it’s impossible to know right now. We can report on what we’ve heard, but we’re not gonna say that that is the 100% truth yet. Until things have been checked and we know for sure that it is, you know, the truth of some situation.

Selley Abebe  15:07  

It must be so reassuring for kids to have an outlet in a space like this. But I imagine as parents, right? I mean, like the whole reason why you created this, it’s so nice to have a space where you feel like your kids can just participate freely, and, you know, get information, and probably have answered questions that are in their mind, that they may not even think to ask.

Tracy Kaplan  15:31  

Right, right, or questions that you as an adult are, you know, kind of not sure on that you want to know. I have so many adults who came up to me after we did our episode on the Russian invasion of Ukraine, and they were like, you know, we had kind of a terms that you’re probably hearing like, what is NATO? And then we said, like, why is it now Kyiv instead of Kiev? And I had so many adults come up to me and they’re like, Thank you. Thank you for answering that. It’s because of the Russian way of saying it versus the Ukrainian way of saying it. But you know, that came from me as an adult being like I grew up learning it was Kiev. Why are they all saying Kyiv? Now, what happened? And no, you know, NBC news isn’t going to stop their broadcast to explain that, you know, so that’s where we come in.

Selley Abebe  16:20  

I love that. That’s actually a great example to highlight. So at First Focus on Children we cover all issues impacting kids from early childhood, maternal health all the way up to education, nutrition, poverty, tax and budget, child welfare. And we even have started to do over the last three or four years, we’ve been building out an international portfolio as well. And so I’m just curious, as you’ve had this show now the last five years, and you have such a good pulse on young kids, are there certain issues that they are interested in, you know, like with the child tax credit, with poverty, are there things that you’ve seen themes that have bubbled up that kids are really passionate about?

Tracy Kaplan  17:04  

Definitely anything that touches on a sense of fairness. So fairness in terms of access to school, access to food, the right to play in sports, if you’re transgender, truly just the right to be who you are and not be attacked for that. I mean, that really comes across in terms of the feedback we get, the requests that we get for stories that we do, and it makes me hopeful for the world. It’s like, oh, there’s some really good humans out there, but from the kids that, that we engage with, they want the world to be fair for themselves and for their friends and for kids that you know live in other parts of the world that they don’t even know.

Selley Abebe  17:53  

All right, let’s pause right here after the break. Tracy shares how she thinks about starting tough conversations with kids, with grown ups, really with anyone. And she tells us why trusting kids means asking them the right kind of questions. Welcome back, ambassadors. We’re talking with Tracy Kaplan, the creator of The Ten News, about what it means to really listen to kids about their wonders and worries and what they want from the world, as you’ll hear next, she’s not just listening, she’s acting on what they ask. And one thing that I you know, that I want to ask is giving your background in YouTube and just the rich history that you had before you transitioned to this new platform, what are some of the things that parents, educators, listening should know about news right now and as it relates to children?

Tracy Kaplan  18:53  

I think you know, we’ve seen such a shift over, I would say the last decade of you know, just going to kind of click bait and really biased headlines. And I think that’s something for parents to really be talking with their, their kids and really looking at themselves. There’s a great website called all sides that will take three articles on the same topic and show you the headline from the right, a headline from the left and a headline from the center, and I think it is such a great illustration of that words matter, and that how you construct a headline to a story can already bias the reader. And it’s something that in the podcast space, I think a lot about is, you know, families are putting their trust in us. And so I really think about like, how are we presenting the story, what our own, you know, biases that we’re bringing in when we are writing and constructing things. And, you know, where do we make sure that. We are, you know, giving families also the tools to then go further and do their own research beyond that.

Selley Abebe  20:06  

For kids listening, for parents, listening. How can they stay engaged with you? Beyond listening?

Tracy Kaplan  20:13  

Oh, yeah. Well, listening is number one. And then, you know, we have both a phone number and an email address. So hello at the 10 news.com and then one, 870, 7t, n, n, e, w, s, that’s our voice line. Really fun fact, Google right now is popping up our phone number if you search News Ten or Ten News, and it is not making it clear that it is for a kids podcast. So I’ve been getting some very interesting voicemails that is hilarious, and I’ve been trying to figure out which Ten News station it’s for. So at least, like, I could reach out and be like, hey, you know, maybe let your listeners know to double check the phone number that they’re calling, but I would love to hear from families and listeners. We are also wrapping our season up and so on our website, and in the description for our last few episodes that we’re doing for the season, we are putting a listener survey, and that is where I would really love to hear from parents. Even if you’ve never listened to the show, I would love to hear from parents and kids of what they would like as we, you know, start to think about our next season, and what are the areas that they would like us to go deeper on.

Selley Abebe  21:36  

Yeah. I’m sure the election will be yes. Will be front and center? Yeah. Tracy, thank you for your time. You know, we ask all of our listeners, this is a tradition on Speaking of Kids, is I feel like in your case, it may be more of an open ended question, but a song that’s really uplifting to you, or just a song that gets you going, we have a running playlist that we ask all of our guests to contribute to. 

Tracy Kaplan  22:05  

I love it, and that’s very hard, but one that just reminds me of my kids school all the time is the song Happy. Their school uses it for a bunch of things, and during the pandemic, they used it when, we were doing a lot of video calls, and just to kind of get us get the parents, kind of in a better mood. And so no matter what, if I even just hear like, two lines of it, I just immediately, like, feel my shoulders start to bump, and a smile come on my face. So I know it’s a little bit of an older it’s been out for a while, but it’s not overdone for me.

Selley Abebe  22:40  

Oh, my God, no, that’s a classic. I mean, Pharrell is. He’s a genius, exactly. And funny story about that song is so when my daughter was going into kindergarten, all the kindergarten teachers did a little dance to that song, and she had identified a teacher that I don’t know, like really stood out to her, and she didn’t end up getting her and fast forward a few months into the school year, the teacher that she had relocated, and so she had an opportunity to get mixed in with another class. And so I put in a request. And long story short, her name was Mrs. Little, but she is now in her class. And every time I hear that song, I think I love it, this teacher and just the relationship they have. And yes, it puts people in a good mood. Yep, of all ages, too. Of all ages. Of all ages. It’s a great song. Yeah, it’s a great song. Tracy, thank you so much. Thank you. This was wonderful. Who that was a rich conversation, and so affirming. What Tracy said about fairness really stuck with me how kids care not just about themselves, but about other kids they’ve never met before. That kind of empathy, that’s what we should really all be building in our media, in our policies and all around if you’re a parent, an educator, an auntie, a neighbor, are just someone who wants kids to grow up informed instead of overwhelmed. Go check out The Ten News. It’s smart, it’s joyful, and it’s exactly what a lot of families are looking for as always. Thanks for being here. Speaking of Kids, is a podcast by first focus on children. It’s produced by Windhaven productions and blue jay Atlantic. Elizabeth Windom is the supervising producer. Julia Windom is the editor and Jay Woodward is the Senior Producer. For more information about this episode, visit firstfocus.org.